Guys and Gals,
Just wonderin how many tracks in Mich. actually allow soaking of tires?
Am interested to know as I ran across a track that lets the drivers soak.
THANKS

None that Im aware of. There are environmental concerns. If they do they really shouldn't.

Tracks allow you to soak, just not on there property.
Whittemore is the only track that I've told it is ok, but sure there is other tracks.

I still can't believe that there are actually people out there doing this with all the possible health concerns, and all the environmental hazards that go along with it. All in the name of picking up a little bit of speed that won't last. I will NEVER understand this one.

Smoking is not good for you, and people do it, myself included. But the dangers of soaking, just to go a LITTLE faster, makes NO sense to me. Not only are you endangering your own health, but anyone sitting in the grandstands has to breath that stuff in every time a car with soaked tires runs a lap.

Chris wrote a big article on this very subject a while ago. Maybe it's time to repost it again bro.

Great...and I was in an enclosed area with some "suspected" soaked tires during a race day.

If your not having more kids your probably ok! No one eye one horned kiddies.

Ed.. there isn't much difference health wise between smoking and tire soaking.

Whittemore took thier printed rule out a couple years ago because there were lots of folks just purchasing the undetectable type of stuff and they really could not police it accurately. When you cannot tech a rule- why get accusations started. They do not have a large enough facility or budget to impound peoples tires. Do they encourage soak? Not really. They did not chase after it because they did not have the resources to check everyone fairly. From a parts business standpoint Personally I used to be totally against because of health implications- now I advise people of the health implications and let them choose thier own course. Anyone that has ever bought soak from my business would attest that I preach heavily, heavily against it health wise. (They might not confess on here) Lots and Lots of folks buy soak. They are not all Whittemore folks either. Like Ed said about smoking. You cannot choose another persons course. We have and have not used it. I have used it on old regattas. It helped short burst. Its not a cure for a bad handling car though. If you have a wheel spinning it just shreds it quicker.

Ive used it! Ive seen some of the most well respected people in racing get caught using it. If your durometering tires you can tech it. If a tire is mile out of the softness range of what it should be something was done to it. When I was teching at the big O we had a driver leave black lines from his pit to the chute dan told him to go ahead and bring us those tires after your done hot lapping. You give a minimum durometer number and thats that.

Oh God NO - no kids.....with my husband they would definately have horns.....

Real health problems with that , The track i race at had a few drivers that soaked thier tires all year and then for the other drivers to have to inhale that stuff isn't good . Last year all i did was cough during the nite of racing then i was fine during the week till i was at the track again. This year no problems because they was checking for that stuff.

There is no doubt how dangerous it is, but in the quest to win some will take food out of thier childs mouth! Nothing suprises me anymore. Just win baby!

So very time there is something hard to tech, you're just going to make it ok!!! WOW!! Isn't that great!

tire soaking is "normal" and acceptable at go kart tracks across the contry!

So some think rubber dust flies? It looks to me like it collects on the top of the track. Why does no one worry about brake dust? Not politically correct or in style to complain about that. I don't see rubber dust flying anywhere.
Worry about kids going deaf cause some have no mufflers and their exhaust points right at the 6 year old in the front row with no hearing protection. We are beating a dead horse with the soaking issue and just who has ever been penailzed for doing it. Not one person who I can think of. Who has done it,lots if not most of us. Anyone had an illness traced medically back to tire soak? Connecting things randomly together will not do.
It is not enforceable and not one thing has ever been proven so what now?

Dick you are the most contrary person ever! That said we busted two people for soaking during our era at O you know one was married to the 1st family of racing in MI.

If as many people soak tires undetected as you say, then how could tire soaking and health affects be unconnected without question? If nobody can be confirmed as being around soaked tires, how can a disease be connected to it?

Read the can it comes in , says: can cause CANCER

I think what they mean is it isn't easily detectable with common equipment found at the track. Give me a tire sample, a gas spectrum IFR scan and I can tell you if its been soaked and with what. And the MEAs and DEAs used in these formulations are known carcinogens and require special handling and disposal. Tire soaking should be not only prohibited, but illegal.

Chad is right.

How about a heat probe and a durometer. That's all it takes. Spend a few weeks plotting the tire durometer vs temp and you create a rule from it. No CSI needed.


I got pretty discouraged from seeing people's trailers that have black streaks all the way to the front where the car was rolled in and out every week. Take a look around, they are out there.

The black tracks are one clue that no one has ever followed up on. The guy with the durometer standing by pit road after the race has never busted anyone I know of. If your tires are still dripping when being dismounted you are still not busted.
I would say that painting your living room and then sleeping in the house at all for weeks will give you the same results as tire soaking since most chemicals used are the same. Toluline,acetone and such things are in the paint thinners you use.
Why does no one care about the kids ears and their breathing brake dust all night. What is so wrong with people that they do not see a REAL problem that is blaring your ears into old age 50 years too soon? I would suppose if someone in the "In Crowd" complained that would make it cool with the followers and maybe a real problem would be solved. I carry mickey mouse ears for my grandkids and ear plugs for me and I try to wear them all the time at the track. I see this as a REAL problem cause I can hardly stand the noise myself. Why don't all you do gooders do something about that instead of bitching about something !/3 of racers do (soak)?
Have someone stand and take numbers of every car that leaves black marks from the trailer to the track and all the way around the track. I busted several people this year alone and asked if the soak was slippery for a few laps while they were sliding around leaving black marks during practice. Not one denied it. But then we talk like a bunch of old ladies and go to sleep saying we can do nothing so it gors on and on and on. Call those with black rubber tracks up in front and ask for an explanation for those marks from them and not most others.
This horse is dead and some keep beating it. Big Ed take on this noise problem that has been ticking off the people who live by tracks and people who do not come to races beacuse it is too loud for them.Not to mention our families who are always there.
I put a huge muffler on to do my part when asked a few years ago and many still have open pipes pointing right at my families ears in the stands. We were told if we make too much noise we would not race. NEVER HAPPENED.
Solve a real problem.......

# 1 I am not a soaker,I have tried it it didn't cure my problem.#2 I agree with Dick 100 percent,if you want to wine about health issue's anything auto related causes cancer.IE brakleen,carbcleen,thinner and so on.Enough said,Keep smoking we all love the second hand smoke in are face!

One note about the "environmental impact" of tire soak.

There are few tracks in the country that were more famous for their use of soak than Kalamazoo during the Jones era. To this day, it's almost ENCOURAGED by the 250+ cars who run the "Super Shoe Nationals" annually.

Now...a lesson on the design of that track. When it rains, EVERY drop of water that falls within the walls of the track, goes into a drainage system below the infield where it is funnelled outside the track through a drainage pipe onto a vacant lot.

Well, a little more than a year ago, Gary Howe sold that piece of property. Before the sale, an "Environmental Impact" study was done on the land.

...clean bill of health.

Your cancer risk is higher from refueling the car than it is from soak.

As a former Kalamazoo employee who straddled the soak/non-soak eras...the elimination of soak had a HUGE effect on the racing at that track. Used to be great fun watching the Supers...the guys with the heavy soak shooting through the field into an early lead...and then tyring to hang on as the tires went away and the field caught up. And...it was a HELL of a lot cheaper to soak, then to buy two new tires EVERY week.

Dick is right on with the tire soaking too. You can buy all the active ingrediants at Home Depot. They are also in several household chemicals. Xylene is the most common and you can buy it anywhere, it's also commonly found in racing gasoline as an octane booster. That's not to say that I would take a bath in the stuff, but just like any other chemical if you handle it with care it should be no issue. It also evaporates into the air and is long gone before it reaches the fans. It's already broken down the rubber to soften it.

The only problem I have with soaking tires is that it's illegal, so I dont do it. Feel free to check the floor in my trailer, take samples of my tires, or do whatever you want if it doesn't cost me anything.

Like Tim said, you still gotta be setup correctly to gain from soaking. If you take a car that sucks and put latemodel tires on it, it still may not be competitive.

I agree with Dick on the hearing issue too, I'm not too cool to wear earplugs, I think I hear better with them in anyhow.

...one last note...

Not ONE TRACK in the world...has banned soak for health or environmental reasons...

...they banned it to sell tires to racers!

Amen Bob, I soaked my tires for years and so did alot of other guys, i never did it to new tires cause they are the best, but by soaking them I could get another week or two out of a set of tires, they were not faster than new tires but they were close, its a MONEY SAVER nothing else, and as Bob said the track makes no money from Hot Lap but they do from Hoosier....Bruce

Not one track has banned leaded fuel either..

Guess Lead isn't bad for you.

I don't mean to sound stupid. I have never soaked my tires, but what do you use to soak the tires that is so bad for your health??

There are a number of things you could use to soak tires. All tires can be "soaked" but it is particularly effective on Hoosiers. Hell, the old Commanche could be "soaked" with almost anything! If you put them in a sealed bag, they'd soak themselves.

Many companies sell products (Hot Lap, etc) for soaking and they all work and can be masked to a different degree. Some of the more successful racers from this area either made their own, or found alternate means to get their "soak." A good friend of mine got his from a chemical company. It was meant for another application, but turned out to be the best soak I ever saw. They didn't really advertise that use for the product, but they didn't shy away from selling it for that use either. Best part of that "soak" was that it wasn't NEARLY as "toxic" as the over-the-counter types. Diluted with three-to-four parts water, it'd only give you a case of the shits.

Typically, the chemical is applied to the tires and then the tires are covered in plastic (ie: Saran-Wrap). They're left in the plastic to soak in the chemicals for a few days and then they're good to go. The "top dawgs" would use a rotisserie system to apply the soak.

At Kalamazoo, guys used to show up with the wrap still on the tires. One of the things that made the Super Shoe, was the fact that is was (until recently) a Hoosier Commanche show. The Commanche was a nearly indestructable hard-as-rocks tire that absorbed soak like a sponge. If they didn't damage them, guys could buy a set of Commanches, run the "Shoe", then put then outside the garage until the following year, when they would soak 'em and race year-after-year.

Some of the commercial soaks are made from several chemicals that have the potential to be toxic. I believe they may include toluene, benzene, and several others. There's a big "NO DOT DRINK" label on the can. No open cuts, no open flames, a pair of rubber gloves, some goggles, and perhaps a mask to cover the face and nose...and your're not in much danger.

I have soaked before...it's a pain-in-the-ass, it takes some time, but it's effective and cheap.

The last year soak was big at Kalamazoo...one multi-time Feature winner...did the season (minus flats) on SIX TIRES.

whats sad is the fact that some will talk about soaking,it's illegal,period,so if you claim to save money or run tires longer,you are a cheater and you must be proud of it,buy a tire and not cheat,darn i hate cheaters!I mean if you have ever,i mean EVER won a race with soaking tires,then you are a real bad cheater and should be banned from racing,you are not out driving the next guy,you are a cheat and if you get satisfaction from cheating and beating then it shows you have no skill at all,just a better chemist and i wish you luck on the toxins your body took in for CHEATING!

Simple cure for it.

Tire impound.

Haven't tried it, thought a lot about it, but, as Gavin and a few others have said here already, it is not allowed at certain tracks, and so, I don't use it.

Dick is right, the noise issue is a big thing, and I always wear ear plugs at the track. Hell, plyaing rock is bad enough for my ears, but I do need to hear what I am playing and where my voice is pitch wise, so I can do a good show. Without hearing what I am doing, I can't play well. One of the things that we do as a band is try to keep the sound level overall down when we are in a bar, outside is a little different because of acoustics, but inside, I can't stand to have things too loud, I'd rather be quieter and better than louder and drive people out.

The race track is the same way. Noise can turn some fans off to our sport. I've no problem with trying to quiet our cars down even more. I have had many people tell me that when I am on the track, my car is one of the quieter ones, but the decibel meter say's differently, so therefore, there must be a lot louder cars than what I meter in at. And, to see young kids, especially the very young, near the front stretch at a track is nearly heartbreaking, because I know it is hurting their hearing at a young age, when they don't know any better.

My grand daughter has yet to be at the track, specifically because of the noise. When she gets old enough to wear ear muffs, then she will come, (gotta bet her broken in soon, so grandpa can buy her a quarter midget).

have a good day,

schinde

Back by Popular Demand...........again.......

Tire Soaking
By Chris Throgmartin


First off let me explain here and please try to understand. I am NOT a Doctor, nor a chemistry professor. Seek out your own expert on any of these matters. I am just relating information from experts in the chemistry and medical fields as well as all the boring chemistry classes I had at MSU and elsewhere. Little did I know stoicheometry would come in handy someday. You should also read all MSDS sheets about these chemicals if you doubt what I say. Another hint here is “Do Not” try and mix your own formulas or use these chemicals for anything other then what they were intended. Chemical reactions can be violent and explosive. It is hazardous to soak tires so don’t even think of undertaking the process. This article is just to educate you on soaking and the side effects of using some of these agents. I am not a fan of soaking, I don’t approve of it and I don’t suggest to anyone they even try it. The risks down the road to you and others health are just much to great.

You should also know that "every tire manufacturer " urges you NOT TO soak. The use of softening agents can damage the tire and create hazards to the racer if the tire " comes apart ". This does not include the health risks to the racer, his family , crew and other people including fans that can occur from soaking. So please, I recommend you don’t even consider trying any of it.

So with all this in mind, why do people continue to soak ??? There are two reasons why. 1.) They are hell bent on winning and keeping up with the competition. If the competition soaks, you either soak or lose out against them. 2.) The tracks are powerless in doing anything about it.

Some have taken hard stances against soaking by implementing TOUGH tire policies like Kalamazoo has done.( You buy your tires just before qualifying and they don’t leave the track ). Without a policy like this tracks will never stop soaking by using sniffers, durometers, etc. At the end of 2003, I personally conducted a confidential survey and found that in the Super Late Model division every single series and track had at least one team who soaked tires during 2003 and were never caught. There are some ingenious methods being used today to skirt even the toughest track and series policing of soaking. Others simply are not trying to hide it and show up with nice shiny tires on race day with soaking agent residue still on the tires sidewalls.

So what is this secret tire soaking formula ?? It isn’t any secret at all. They sell this stuff at Home Depot, Meijers, and Lowes. It is readily available and as a matter of fact is produced in large quantities in the USA. The soaking agents you buy at the speed shop are premixed and are safer to use but carry the same type of chemical compounds and can be a big hazard to you and anyone in the area when being applied.

Racers have since learned of this secret formula and as a matter of fact you can do a search on the net and find the chemical mixtures and formulas listed for you. I am not going to list them here because I don’t want to be a part of anyone’s soaking program and I surely do not want to be responsible for your ongoing battles with leukemia’s or cancer’s. I also have read some of the secret formulas and I highly doubt the methods used by some on the internet are even effective. One that I read actually will create less grip.

So if they sell this stuff at stores, then what’s the problem..??...The problem is that this stuff is nasty. Just because they sell these compounds does not make them safe. Also, weird reactions are caused when " mixing " chemicals, because it alters its original properties. But these compounds by themselves ( even before mixing ) not only have some long term health effects involved with it, but they are down right dangerous to use. The chemicals are also extremely volatile which also means it is explosive, and can level your shop for you in one big blast when used improperly around heat and ignition sources. Some of these chemicals for instance are heavier then air which can create an invisible blanket near the floor and will extend outside the surrounding area of your shop. So what are all these fancy secret potions and chemicals ?..Acetone, Xylene, Toluene and Benzene mixed with “carrier” chemicals. Are all of them mixed together at once...???..No.... Only one solvent such as Xylene or Toluene, etc is used with a carrier. This is the actual chemical that will go to work softening the rubber in the tire. I would need twenty more pages to thoroughly explain what happens when these chemicals come in contact with rubber, but it all boils down to this.

Tires are a huge chain of carbon atoms made from petroleum products. By introducing a chemical such as Xylene or Toluene or Acetone ( all of these are also petroleum products) the chemical expands the space the rubber molecules reside in and allows them to be freer and have more area to move around inside. Now apply heat to that tire out on the track and you have even more space for the rubber to "move around in" thus in the process creating a "softer" tire. After the race, the chances are that the tire you soaked is going to start becoming hard once the race is over. In a very brief time it will be very hard after sitting. Why ? Because the chemicals I listed above are very volatile and will evaporate into the air. VERY FAST. This is one reason why sniffers do little to detect the chemicals after a race.

As it dissipates or releases into the atmosphere, guess what’s happening ? Some of the hydrocarbons or " rubber " is going with it . When this happens, the " area " that was expanded by the softening agents starts collapsing and all that space for free movement is gone and some of the pre-existing hydro carbons are also gone, which results in a harder tire. Depending on the compound used by the manufacturer and how the chemicals were mixed, your tires can be junk in 45 – 50 laps.

My own thought is that these chemicals are NOT worth the extra few tenths on the track. Not when you consider the side effects of using them. Some are thought now to cause skeletal defects in unborn babies, ( not to mention what it does to the mother ). Some of these chemicals are gene mutants, causing genes to mutate and produce some terrible birth defects. They also are very good at finding and attacking stem cells which can produce cancers and leukemias. They also can have adverse effects on your liver, brain and other organs. Benzene is not only a carcinogen but also reacts directly on your bone marrow producing some horrible leukemia's which can be fatal. You say you wear gloves and a paper mask and don’t come in contact with it ? Think again.

There are three ways of ingesting any of these chemicals. One being direct contact with the chemical. The second being inhalation ( breathing it ) which goes directly into the blood stream and the third way being ingesting it ( through water & food contamination, etc ) from vapors and residue. The fastest way to get these chemicals into your blood stream is through breathing it. If you can smell the odor, then its in your system. The lungs do an excellent job of transferring chemicals you inhale directly into your blood stream where it can carry throughout the body to other organs. Ever wonder why huffer's sniff paint to get a high ? Ever talked to a huffer ? They typically are on a quick path to being severely brain damaged and some barely know their own names.

I know this is a long article and will possibly raise even more questions, but the fact is, soaking is just something that shouldn’t be tolerated in this sport at any track. It’s senseless, endangers you, your family and unborn children not to mention the race fans and team members who have to breathe the vapors at the track. Try to find another way to win.

Chris

If anyone out there thinks "soaking" agents are not harmful I would beg to differ.

I had a family member who works for a large chemical plant screen many soak recipe samples (some mentioned on this thread) several years ago when we were on the Kazoo "juice" tire plan. A laboratory detail report was assembled. I can tell you the main ingredient most of these soak formulas have includes a plasticizer softening agent used to break down hard plastic for molding purposes. The chemical id is about 25 letters long but one of the concerns is it's association with unborn infant health issues. Uncontrolled in many third world country's, many of these agents are suspected responsible for high infant mortality rates. Soak can transfer thru rubber in minutes, it can do the same thru your skin in seconds. Asphalt and bias tires are both petroleum products when broke down. The softening agent lets the two adhere to each other in a fast time frame. Cold tires must generate heat to adhere, soak slows that time down to seconds which equates to the faster lap speeds if done correctly.

Several companies like Dow and Union Carbide have spent many days in court over such substances and exposure issues. I doubt any local track could survive such a suit if the lawyers were allowed into a soaker track and stirred up the pot.

Really?? How would YOU know this Patrick??? You haven't been around racing long enough to make such a determination.

Noise IS a problem, always has been, always will be. I think every kid out there should have to wear ear plugs. But if you all think that there aren't possible health risk from soaking tires, then by all means, continue to do so, and I guess you get to be the guinea pig here to see if your right or wrong. Hell of a price to pay if your wrong, isn't it?? All to gain a POSSIBLE little bit of speed, and maybe save yourself from buying new tires for a night or two.

Hope it was worth it.

Please take the time to read Chris's study, as I did many years ago, and came to my conclusion about soaking. This is MY opinion. You may disagree, and that's your right.

As far as my second hand smoke goes, don't sit next to me. But the soak vapors seeping from your tires can only be stayed away from if I don't go to the track. Not quite equal is it??

This issue is way over being dead!!!!!!! Can't keep beating a dead horse and get anywhere with it!!!!!!!!!!

The fact of the matter is as stated: You are either one of the ones doing it or one of the ones getting beat by it!!!!!

Kalamazoo Speedway has tried to level the playing field by having a tire barn and hoping to stop the use of tire soak, but if I am not mistaken there has been at least 3 people that have been caught using some type of tire soak with the tire barn.

How many of you complaining about the use of tire soak, use products with the following warning lable:

"KNOWN TO THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA TO CAUSE CANCER"

I personnally do not and will not use tire soak to race on a weekly basis. However, I have and will continue to use it @ special shows that I know for a fact will be in use by others.

Respectfully,
I never said that their weren't health concerns, just that these compounds should be treated the same as using the raw chemicals, such as Xylene, Toluene and Acetone. Gloves, respirator, etc. At the track I have a hard time seeing that the vapors would still be present, or capable of reaching the fans, as it has already evaporated from the tire, broken down the rubber to soften it and gone away. I don't know if there's a lot of hard data either way on that one. Chris makes some solid points, and some people may be more perceptive to illness from several different exposures to chemicals. I think it's a tough argument either way. Fumes from the engines and tire smoke of any sort should be avoided if you feel that you may be perceptive to illnesses caused by these things. Benzene is a very hard chemical on your body, and it's in racing fuel, so get them rubber gloves out next time you change jets or work on that fuel system.

One line is that tire manufacturers URGE you not to soak. Of course they do, if you use new tires 1 week, then soak them the next week to "refresh" them to their new performance, you aren't going to buy new tires. Less new tires = less money to the tire manufacturer.

I'm not trying to ruffle any feathers here, just trying to look at all the data objectively.

The best thing I have to say about not soaking, is that it's clearly against the rules, and as such it's cheating, cheating with an intent to gain an advantage on your competition. It's also unsafe to the driver in some cases. I've heard that some soaks are too aggressive and can destroy the integrity of the tire and cause chunks of tread to fly apart. It's cheaper to by 4 new skins then it is to pile the car into the fence.

That's a very very solid point. EVERYTHING in the coleman catalog that is made of steel has that same warning label. Typically it's not even because of the contents of the part, but of the solvents used in the machining and cleaning of the parts.

Any bolts with the hexchromate finish with have the same warning label.
Any Carburetor will have it.
Anything that is that yellow/gold metallic finish will have it, radius rods, valve covers, etc.

They should have that warning label on exit doors in California, because the air is just as bad to breathe as touching radius rods is.

i just have to say im not a big fan of tire soaking. yes i have done it before in the past i will admit, but to try to use health concerns as a reason to stop it well honestly start reading some packages even carefree gum has a warning that says that chewing that gum can give you cancer (maybe they should change their name) my point is that in the racing community we are subjected to lead fuel, oils, cleaners, thinners, and a host of other poisonous liquids that are harmful to our health and thats before we climb into a enclosed poorly ventilated racecar that is spewing toxic fumes all around us. so comon lets face it heres the Surgeon General's Warning in case none of you are aware RACING CAN BE HAZARDOUS TO YOUR HEALTH. racing will never be 100% safe and it doesnt matter if you sit in the last row or in the drivers seat there is always some risk involved with our sport from flying parts and rocks to noise to emissions to fire. now like i said at the beginning im not big on tire soaking i believe it does cause a enviromental risk which can be avoided just as antifreeze is, but people are going to use it because it is an advantage and because drivers and crews are always looking for that thing that will get us another tenth. we race and we know the risk and we make our choices every time right or wrong we choose. A little more risk for a little more speed, or maybe a little slower but a little safer.

well the soap box is free now for anyone who wants it,

Greg

I think anything anymore causes cancer. Talking on your cell phone, too much sun, not enough sun, paint, gasoline fumes, exhaust fumes, candy, pop, water, food, eyeglasses, hairspray, driving your car, walking at night, walking in the day, running, watching television, plastic toys, shoe laces, dreams, nightmares, daydreaming, and any else you can think of.
I dont soak, (I got busted once, that was embarrassing enough) but it is too bad that something that can save racers so much money, has to be illegal and bad for you. I know of a guy that ran 15 nights on a single set of tires and was still competitive. He spent less than $100.00 on soak, probably saved over $1000.00 easy

Back to the spirit of the point.

Tire soak is illegal at many tracks, with signs saying no soaked tires on premises, or soak on premises.

So, it should be considered illegal and not done.

But, that won't change it, everyone looks for an edge. I just don't look for the soak edge myself.

I have seen cars leave the black stripes coming out of the trailer, and followed cars during qualifying sessions and saw them leave nice little black, tire width stripes down the stretches, with no smoke at all coming from the tires, and seen it stop after a few laps. I'd surmise there was soak involved in those cases.

I do know this, soak is not healthy for the longevity of the track surface, those chemicals attack the petroleum base of asphalt, little by little of course, but attack it anyway, kind of like rust on metal.

That in itself is not good for our sport, most promoters cannot afford to resurface when the track gets worn, let alone have that wear accelerated, by ever how much, through the use of soak.

Just don't think it is good for our sport. Money saver, probably, but, our sport costs money.

My point of view only.

have a good day,

(note I am using a disclaimer?)

schinde

In my shop, I use a readily available choke spray anytime I need to clean off small parts and then I blow them dry with compressed air. I do this all the time and have been doing it for many, many years.

On the can the warning label says that it contains acetone, heptane, and tolyene. I get it on my skin all the time and breath it whenever I am spraying it.

I guess that explains the brain disfunction and why I am attempting to be a promoter.

-Maurice

No...that just explains you trying to run a Chrysler in NASCAR...LOL!

BTW...back then, Buddy Arrington was one of my heroes! (Kids, ask your dad who Buddy Arrington was).

Breast implants are bad for women too...but Chris still goes to Hooters!

"Better performance through chemisty!" (HA HAAAAA!)

...M-40 is allowing soak again next year...

Maurice, I wont go there about getting into promoting. I think you may have some valid points on that one.

The one thing I failed to mention in my previous post is that one person is going to be carrying a set of stem cells that can easily transform into a mutation and then there are those whose stem cells can take abuse and stay normal. I was one who had stem cells that could not take the abuse and they turned on me - viciously. ( it took a few years of course to do so ). I had one stem cell that may have come into contact with one of these nasty chemicals and it went haywire. It then over powered all my other stem cells and in time replaced the normal ones with the mutated variety. Before you knew it I was on my way to a full blown bone marrow / leukemia type disease that has no cure.

My last eight years has been anything but fun. Over 10 bouts of injecting a synthetic chemo drug that makes life miserable as hell to live. Constant bone marrow pain. A spleen that is the size of a football and causes excruciating pain in the side. My blood and cell lines have gotten so far out of whack that it caused over 12 mini strokes and 3 full strokes from blood clots. My bone marrow is still spitting out morphed and deformed blood cells and my life expectancy will probably never allow me to see my grandchildren grow to become adults.

I wished I knew if this was all caused by these chemicals but I cannot. It's to hard to say how I ever got this disease ( which brings me to this point ). Some of us will have cells like yours that can fight off the effects of these diseases. And some of us
( like myself ) will have cells that will mutate in a heartbeat and give us full blown cancers or leukemias. Now the tricky part is how do you know which category your in ? It's a roll of the dice isn't it ?

I can say this much. I have been through hell and back several times fighting this disease. My life has been shortened, my organs have taken a beating, my brain is about toast from the strokes and the life I once knew is nothing but a memory. It now all centers around ongoing bouts with chemo and a boat load of pain and sickness. You no longer own your life, your disease owns it and dictates your everyday activities.

This isn't a sob story as I do not want anyones sympathy. But it is a warning to others that it can happen to anyone. I guess your post struck a nerve in me as it sounded like you were implying " Look at me. I have been using these chemicals and I am fine ". Your one of the lucky ones Maurice. All I wanted to do was point out that I used them and I am not OK.

I just wanted to show people the other side of using these chemicals. A lot of people look up to both of us Maurice and I feel we have a duty and responsibility to guide them in this sport with sound advice. I didn't post this to get on your butt here but just wanted others to know that you can handle this stuff for years and never have a problem. Or you can handle it a few times and your life may take a horrible right turn and end up like mine.

No harm intended and no foul here brother. I just wanted to show the other side of this debate.

Chris

Can you point me to a readily available 110 or 112 octane fuel that is not leaded?

I can understand not wanting/allowing soaking but to say that all tracks should ban race fuel is just looking for something to grasp onto.

M40 Speedway is allowing tire soak for the 2008 season just not on track grounds.

Methanol

We all think the smell of burning rubber and racing fuel and brake dust brings back old memories of racing and how good it smells in the spring after sitting out the winter and then bitch about tire soak that has never been smelled or noticed by anyone.
Why not turn that thinking around? That stuff will kill ya. Methanol does not accumulate in the blood as gas fumes do. Carbon monoxide builds in the blood and displaces iron I believe and reduces your ability to transport oxygen to your cells. The lead builds up also. These are sloooowly washed out of your system over years not weeks or months. So why complain about a non existant problem(soak) when we have so many important things we could do?
Eliminate gas and noise that we feed our fans if you want to help in a REAL way. Make everyone run alky for safety reasons instead of most cars carrying a gas bomb around behind them.

Dear Lord grant me the strength to make it through this off season. Soak is illegal, so don't do it. I've raced for 11yrs, tried it for one night just to see what all the hype was about. I wasn't impressed. I'll buy a tire over a jug of that crap any day. The chemicals in soak are destroying tracks, it eats at the road surface. To sit here and say that it's not bad for you is what we read off the can. What a load of crap! How about this, I'll continue to run LEGAL (by every rule, so we're clear). Be proud of what I do and how good I run due to hard work, not spending all week juicing my fricken tires. I'm glad I race with people that think that blatent, low down, cheating is a good thing. Cheating to me is like stealing my money, you might as well walk up call me an expletive and punch me in the mouth. Because that's what I'm going to think about you when you cross the line right ahead of me. I've beat a lot of good soaked cars with out, and left with a smile on my face because they'll just go home and juice an even better set. Dick do you soak is that why you keep changing this to another topic? You could add another one like this only label it brake dust and propose we quit using them to keep the dust down.

We only debate subjects that are in style on here is why I bring up other things that are not in style. So you cheated once did ya? How tall were your sail panels when you finally got to the track? How close were they to the side panels. Both were ilegal and we all noticed it so don't say you are squeaky clean. You could have made them legal when you were making them.
Not one thing has been proven about tire soak being bad. Do not drink the stuff or rub it on your body and you and everyone else will be fine. Worry about a REAL problem.
The racing theme is"its only cheating if some one else does it but it does not help or hurt if I do it".So where are some hard facts of someone being poisioned or harmed by a racetrack. I was riding my bicycle on a river trail where no vehicles have ever been driven on it and guess what? It was old and worn just like a racetrack gets after a few years. I suppose those bicycle riders soak their tires cause there can be no other reason for the trail being worn down and have a rocky surface. The tar had to go somewhere. We do not use facts to determine these things in this club. Only popular consenus. As long as they soak at home I guess there is nothing wrong.