Seems like I posted the same thing a year ago but this is a copy of a letter from IMCA:

January 31, 2008

Dear IMCA Modified Driver:


As in 2007, the engine claim for IMCA Modifieds at Crystal Speedway in Crystal, Michigan will be a straight $525.00 cash claim, with $25.00 going to the wrecker. There will be no exchange option of engines involved.

Should you have any question or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me by phone at 319-472-XXXX, extension XXX or by email at XXXXXXXXXX.com.

Respectfully,


Brett Root
Vice President of Operations

Cc: Ron Flinn
Joe Skotnicki
Ed Billings

SWEEEEEET!!!!!!

CLAIMS SUCK

i myself think the claim is a good thing and if i get claimed again i know i am running good agian. hope everyone has fun this year. i hope to find the winner circle at crystal. toby

To each his own...

I cannot say enough BAD things about engine claiming...so I'll shut up.

Mike

Hey Mike, u goin bowlin tomorrow? Its my neighborhood so if u do let me know and u can stop by the house. Pre party party.

Not gonna make it...

Claims Suck? Whats it to Ya? You don't race IMCA so don't worry about it. Its short sighted races that will ruin or kill this sport. I do race IMCA and I think and know that the claim works. IMCA works. Look at the car counts, we average 35 to 40 cars per night. This year early predictions are over 40 per night!
Uniform rules everywhere.

So where are you Claim Haters racing this year?
What do you think the car count will be? 10, 15, maybe 20?
What tire you guys running, is it Hoosier or American racer, has that ever been decided, What size, 8" or 10"
How about the shocks?
What nose is legal and where?
What rules are inforced for the Sam Faur Memorial race?
Has it been narrowed down so that any of the tracks have the same rules?
Is it Tour rules? American Modified Rules? Auto City Speedway Mod Rules? or USA Mod Rules, which is it?
Mirrors?
Radios? (Radios? You guys really run full blown radios?)
Fab lowers or stock?
Stock drag link?
What LS weight percentage?
4" spoiler or bigger?
No right side exhaust?
Do we have to weigh before the race or after?

No I wouldn't like the claim rule either, with everything else you guys have to worry about, there just isnt any way you would have the time to build a couple of Claimer engines.

Dont get me wrong, I dont always think IMCA is perfect, but it sure beats the alternative!
Brennan

PS....Crystal Motor speedway has a big show at the end of the year, and you know what????? We know know exactly what the rules are. No discussions or meetings. Oh, and it pays $3000. to win!

How would you know that?

I think Brennan collected that check if I recall!

I don't think anyone ever said they didn't like IMCA...Or that it doesn't work...

The big claim debate can come up later, as it has in the past...But this isn't the time.

Mike

That $3000 sure is nice!!!!!!!

BANG !

If I recall 747jet ALSO won it the previous year.

Jimmy won one? Nope... don't recall it! LOL... I was there if I recall.

IMCA national rules states that the one that get claims has a choice of an exchange. Not sure what Ron's motive is. The straight sell hurts those that do not have extra motors and could end someone season. Just my opinon.

Still not wanting to enter a debate in a topic pertaining to Crystal Speedway (My opinion on the claim should not be directed towards any 1 track, especially one that I feel is run VERY well), But I must agree with this.

If a new guy wants to start running dirt mods, and he plans to do well, how many motors does he need to pay to have put together and how much is each one going to cost him???...only to sell them to someone who doesn't know that motors don't win races on 1/4 mile dirt tracks... for $500...

So...Claim rules are good for junkyard owners who have a whole yard full of engine parts. That is not the future of racing...

So, think for real...How does this affect the new guy who is considering a modified? I was that new guy a few years back and that's why I race asphalt. I only started with a $2000 engine, but it was mine and I kept it running for ME.

Again...don't start arguing, just think and reflect...

Mike

Maybe this is why they have a b.main every nite and pavement tracks have 10 cars
Mike since you been out of racing so long go check out those junk yard motors and the
people who run them You would think different You are the guy who has beat the best mods at owosso with used tires and a 2000 dollar motor you would dominate on the dirt with your knowledge I would love to see it



A Current mod guy

I would love to try it. I also agree that I would likely do well.

Here's my point. Right now I do not own even 1 complete engine of my own. I do not have time in my life to spend 30 hours a week scavenging parts and trying to find money for gaskets and putting together motors all the time.

I do not want to wait for someone to take my motor from me when I'm already done racing and it's time to go home.

That isn't the kind of game I want to play. I don't own or have a junkyard sponsor, so therefore I cannot AFFORD to race in a claim class because it costs too much in time/money for me.

And no with no swap option, I can not even begin to consider such a thing...

Mike

P.S> what the heck kind of way to sign a message is that??? Quit taking pokes at me... You actually made a good post, but you had to stick that in there.

Just in case you've had your head in the sand, the 12x will be on the track at least 14 times this year.

And for another matter, I don't have to have EVER driven a mod to be intelligent about the subject.

Claims suck is all there is to that subject. Race junk if you want,hope you build a dozen of them. One good motor costs less than 6 junk ones that blow up or get claimed.
When I was at Crystal there were not even close to 40 cars and a good deal of them were junk by our asphalt standards. Rusty old pieces of junk. Many at that palo race I went to were rusted out scrap iron cars so they are fine with a junk motor.
We go to fast on pavement to have some claimer junk motor destroy half the field behind them when they spew oil all over.
Dirt is like racing in slow motion to me,fun but slow.I have had motors claimed so don't think i haven't been there.

Just for sake of conversation, how many claims were there at Merritt last year? or how many MMA claims were there overall?

I'm assuming that you ran Merritt most of the time, since that was the only track I saw you at, and you ran pretty well that night... I had planned on coming by and complimenting you had I seen you afterwards.

I think the car count argument has more to do with the Dirt tracks being stronger overall than the pavement tracks.


Some guys like the claim, some don't, that's prolly why there are differing rules.

Mod911 you had dirt in your eyes at both tracks There are real nice cars on dirt believe me Ive seen your car and theres I guess you better go look around at the front running cars upnorth Now i Know for a fact you have a cast stock motor in your car know How much you have in it Dick!!! how junk is it i know that you put it together on friday before you went to spartan and ran in the front on cast junk crap!! would you buy another one for 525? if you win races with $600 motors i guess they have the same junk at Crystal as you !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





Now come get me well fight on the pond HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Crystal was running a B and a C Main in modifieds this year. From opening night to Great Lakes Nationals at the end of the season, there were 42 different mod drivers who collected a win from Crystal whether it be a heat race, consi race or an A-Feature win.

Crystal had the second highest modified count nationwide for a track that ran modifieds as a steady class. It was very rare when the mod count dropped below 40 and it usually was brushing 50+.

Crystal is a top notch facility which is why I am hesitant to enter a claim debate in this thread. We don't know if it's because of the claim rule or not, but the package is working... How dare I or anyone else suggest change- I just say it isn't for me...

Not with my equipment anyhow... As always, I'd love to give it a go!

I'm just glad I didn't have to wait 3 hours while a wrecker pulled the motor out of the bus I raced there...lol...!!! It's a long drive home.


Mike

How do you build a 500 dollar motor? I have 400 dollars into rings, bearings and seals...and they aren't great stuff

wellllll you can't unless you have the equipment to do all your own machine work. Look at some of the racing part suppliers that build motors to sell (JR Motorsports) and they are charging $1800 - $2,000 for a flat top 350. You draw your own conculsions on how much are spent on motors you are racing against.

and that's just for the short block

Most of the pack will never have to worry about being claimed as you have to finish in the top five to be claimed 99% of the time... there are certain exceptions) and it has been proven over and over again... motor ain't everything. The anti-claim guys make it sound like there are 50 claims a night but on a seasonal average, I think there were about six claims a year at Crystal. The mod count at Crystal is averaging about 44 to 46 cars a night and many nights, there are a LOT of former and potential feature winners sitting on their trailers come feature time because they didn't make the cut.

As to the prices... look through the classifieds and you'll find a lot of good deals on engines and parts. Racing on dirt is different than racing on tar. Power isn't everything and handling and patience is key. Most guys build their own and aren't spending mega bucks doing all the heavy machining done with other classes. This sanction is working at Crystal just fine.

i just add up all the parts it woul take to build a 383 claimer engines short block for crystal it comes out to 659 plus shipping and i then would put some 882 heads and swap meet intake.most of the time i have about. 900 to 1000 in my motors at crystal.these parts come from speedway motors

Really? From Speedway you can put that motor together that cheap? I'm not trying to bust your chops, but could you share that recipe?

I've seen claimer motors where guys will run them successfully and then when they get bought they blow up the next week. I've also heard of people claiming motors and come to find out it there is something in the motor, heads, intake pistons etc that they had previously owned and it was passed down from others selling it. Once the track goes dry click you can have all the motor you want, just need to be able to put it to the track.

go to speedwaymotors.com it is all there, you use the speedway parts and you can have a good claimer motor. i have run ther stuff and good luck with it.it probuly woud not work in mma or ump but works good in claimer class.

The only thing I buy new is usually the rings, bearings, and gaskets. You would be surprised what shortblocks you can find here and there for $300. Like Toby said, slap some cheap heads on it and a cheap intake and go racing. I just bought a cheapy stroker, balanced, that just needed a rebuild for $200, it was a steal. He just wanted it out of his garage so now if I get claimed it won't hurt as much, it will hurt but I know I can put one together pretty cheap and be back racing in no time.

MOD 73, YA THERE MAY BE A FEW NICER CARS RUNNING UP FRONT BUT THE AVERAGE CAR I SAW WAS NOT EVEN SAFE LOOKING. RUST KILLS DIRT CARS AND SOME ARE RACED AFTER RUST HAS KILLED THEM. I DID DIRT FOR MANY YEARS. lIKE I SAID AT LEAST CYLINDER HEADS ARE NOT BOLTED TO THE REAR BUMPER ANYMORE.I WALKED AROUND AND LOOKED AT ALMOST EVERY CAR WHEN I WAS ON THE DIRT LAST YEAR.
IT REALLY WAS NO DIFFERENT CAUSE SOMEONE DROVE INTO ME JUST LIKE TAR RACIN. MY CAR WAS SWEET LOOKING TILL SOME ONE DROVE IT OVER IT WITH 4 LAPS ON IT. DOWNHILL FROM THERE. IT IS SAFE AND TIGHT UNDERNEATH EVEN WITH BENT AND TWISTED SHEET METAL. UGLY LOOKS GOOD RUNNING IN FRONT OR WINNING.
SO IF 6 MOTORS GET CLAIMED THAT IS A SUCCESS AND EVERYONE RUNS SCRAP IRON? OUT OF HOW MANY RACES? IT SEEMS FOR SOMETHING TO WORK SUCCESSFULLY IT NEEDS TO BE USED EVERY NIGHT. OTHERWISE THE RESULTS MAY NOT BE DIRECTLY TIED TO THE OUTCOME, JUST IMAGINED TO BE RELATED.
YOU KNOW I DON'T SPEND A TON ON MY MOTORS. I STILL DON'T WANT TO GIVE IT AWAY. I SPENT ALL WEEK CHASING PARTS CAUSE SOMEONE TOOK ALL MY PARTS FOR A FEW DOLLARS MANY TIMES.A SWAP IS OK BUT NOT A ROBBERY. SWAPPING KILLS CLAIMING CAUSE THE CLAIMER DOE NOT WANT TO SURRENDER HIS SUPPOSEDLY JUNK EVEN TO GET A HOT WINNING SO CALLED BIG MOTOR. THAT SAYS HOW MUCH HE REALLY BELIEVES THIS CLAIMING THING HIMSELF. HE SHOULD BE HAPPY TO SWAP, NOT WANT SYMPATHY AND GET TO KEEP HIS FEATUE FINISHING MOTOR SO HE HAS SPARE PARTS NEXT WEEK (YOURS) AND YOU GO CHASING.
NOW BEFORE YOU SAY KEEP A SPARE OR TWO AROUND TO GIVE AWAY ASK YOURSELF WHERE THE SAVINGS IN THAT IS.
NOT TO MENTION KEEPING A "BIG" MOTOR AROUND FOR "BIG" OR "NO CLAIM" RACES. THE SAVING ARE ADDING UP. HOW MUCH TIME AND MONEY IS LOST THERE?
I HAVE SEEN SCARY STUFF ON TAR BUT NOT AS BAD AS DIRT. SPEEDS ON DIRT ARE SLOWER THAN TAR I DO BELIEVE. WHAT ARE SPEEDS ON DIRT 3/8 LIKE CRYSTAL?
DID YOU BRING THAT OTHER DIRT CAR HOME WITH YOU?

You guys can keep your cars all polished up and run three miles an hour faster and run your twelve car features... me... I prefer the full 20 car field competition with two or more 12 to 15 car semi features. "Faster" cars spread out all over the field mean nothing to me... I'd ten times rather watch the wheel to wheel racing I see at Crystal every week. I think the full features and semi features, the full grand stands, and the full pits speak for themselves. Crystal has more racing ACTION before the features than many tracks across the country have all night. You guys that don't like the claim rule can whiz your pants all you want... we have a full field of good drivers, lots of good wheel to wheel action, and the fans seem to like it. That's all that matters at this point. When the car count falls to less than 20, I can imagine they might look to change it but until that point, why fix it if it isn't broke?

Whether it's a claimer class or not, it don't matter what it looks like only what you have under the hood. Our truck is in it's 8th year, and I think this is only the third new body we put on it. Original paint job also. It's done a pretty damn good job since.

It's up to the track to determine whether or not your car is safe enough to race whether it has rust or not.

Those who Whine about claim, usually have not been claimed themselves. Some racers race to buy motors. Some don't. Some would buy if someone is dominating and that is what it is about. Usually, in most cases, the motor isn't the reason for the guy winning all them races though the motor does help make you finish races.

Now the guys that claim and think they are going to be fast now mormally end up running where they always do, Can't make the show the following week. HAHAHA!!!!

I think an important point is that people seem to only buy motors of guys that are winning all the time, whether the motor is the reason or not. When there was still a lot of claiming on the pavement, it was usually just to piss someone off that you didn't like, or ruin someone's night that had a good finish. I don't think that does anyone any favors. It sure doesn't keep the cost down.

There doesn't seem to be the same amount of animosity about claims on the dirt. (at least from a causal observer's standpoint)

Well said Verwayne and Jimmy both.

Gaven: "There doesn't seem to be the same amount of animosity about claims on the dirt. (at least from a causal observer's standpoint)" Thats because you know the rules going in. No one likes to be claimed, but it is a part of the racing and its seems to be working. Its like complaining after you get to the races about what tire you have to run when you've know it all year.

I would also add that in most cases the people that are out there claiming are rarely in the top 4 before the claim and rarely in the top 4 after the claim. And it you really pay attention most of the guys that have been claimed will be in the top 4 again.

IMCA isn't for everyone but it seems to be working at Crystal Motor Speedway. I bet there are quite a few promoters in Michigan that would like to average 38 cars a night and from all early indications this year will be 45 or 50.

Brennan, junk car dirt IMCA driver.

Brennen
The guys that run pavement have more in a tire bill than what the feature pays
They say a claim is stupid but spending $400 a nite or every other is fine I agree the
claim would suck But it works there I raced pavement mods for 4 yrs now dirt 4 years
and believe me dirt is way cheaper Pavement you have sign up for points at every track
Not on dirt Tire impounds on pavement OH BUT we have 11 cars for the show tonight I aint
seen a b feature on pavement on reg nite for along time Just think pavement gets you home early!!


My 2 cents
From a Dirt rusty Mod Guy

Asphalt is fun.

I would like to try dirt someday.

Different strokes for us all.

I'm pleased that we have no claim rule for asphalt mods on the area tracks that I can run at.

have a good day,

schinde

Now I did not say they were all junk. There are some nice cars on dirt but not near the quality of a average tar car. Just about every car is sweet looking and clean and well built underneath.Not so on dirt.
Everyone knows claiming is for losers,if you weren't a loser you could not claim. Even if you have a good enough motor to make the show and claim someone you are still a loser. I lost many thousands of races so losing is no big deal. Brennan is right,the loser will be losing with a winners motor and a winner win be winning with a losers motor. I lost my first motor about 88 or so to Ken Love so don't think I don't know the feeling of waking up and seeing a hole in your hood where your air cleaner should be stickin up.
Kind of a sick feeling cause your whole week will be wasted chasing parts and puttin them together and installing.
I like sliding around on the dirt, why do you think I bring my asphalt car to play in the dirt????

My goodness boys, why do we need a pissin contest about this???

BOTH dirt and asphalt are GREAT!!! They both have their downfalls, and their upsides.

Because you prefer one over the other doesn't mean someone else feels differently, and is wrong for it. And you know what, there is absolutely nothing wrong with that!!! We all have different......taste.

I throughly enjoy both. Claimer, non-claimer, whatever. That's for each track to decide what is best for them. There is no need to try and slam one over the other. It's racin, isn't THAT what this is all about???

I completely agree Ed. If you don't like a claiming class... don't run it... but don't try to stop or belittle those that choose to run such a class. I fully expect to see fields of 45 to 55 IMCA Mods at Crystal this year on a weekly basis. The action will be, as it always is, incredible. As a selfish plug, you will be able to watch that action every week from Crystal via the Internet! Several other local tracks are also on board.

Check it out: http://www.crystalmotorspeedway.com/video.html

Oh ED where tired of being locked in the house we need some racin Im ready to race anywhere i love both sides tar and dirt I wish it was more like the old days at owosso with 40 mods and supers great racin and great people Hey count me in at Brian Henneys race i will come slide around and piss those serious guys off I still have people ask me about that day

See ya soon

I think we're all in that same boat, IT'S TIME dang it!!!

I too long for those days of countless Mods on asphalt, I can't wait to get to Crystal opening night to watch all the great racing there too!!!

I LOVED it when you guys brought your dirt Mods over last year, Joey Fowler, Brad Roberts and yourself put on a show all by yourselves, sure gave me a lot to talk about. What a sight that was!!!!! I'll come say HI when Brian's Memorial race comes up.

Hang in there guys, just a few more days away!!!! Then we'll all have something REAL to bitch about!!!!

Toledo 10 days away!!!

Well let's see, how much moisture is on a tar track everynight? See, when you race on dirt, the "wet" clay will sometimes stick to your chassis and or frame and sit there and eat into the metal, how many stones and gravel and stuff come off a tar track and CONSTANTLY peck the underside of a car?

A lot, they stick to the tires and get drug onto the track when the cars come out of the pits.