I wonder how long they have been pulling this little trick:
http://www.scenedaily.com/news/articles/na...no_numbers.html

Your the one guy who can answer this--when did Nascar start using a chassis dyno to check hp??? I thought that they pulled the motor, set it on a dyno, and did the pulls.

Do you think this will be the largest fines ever??? Maybe banishment??? Or maybe Toyota does "own" Nascar...Or maybe Nascar looked at the Toyotas that were supposed to slow up and wonder why they were still so fast...

Just the ramblings of an old seat guy

They have been chassis dynoing for quite a few years now, I imagine this will be the largest Nationwide fines ever 100-150k the crew chiefs will be suspended for the rest of the season, Nascar will come down hard, as they should

Some of the people on the scenedaily website think it's Joe Gibbs himself cheating....clueless, absolutely clueless.
How exactly can a magnet hamper things, unless they used it as a throttle stop?

That is exactly what they used it for, a throttle stop so W.O.T. couldnt be obtained so the hp numbers would be less. Now the question is when was put there, and by who?

from what I heard the magnet was indeed put between the throttle pedal and the stop, Believe me when I say this came from High up the decision to do this was not made by some Mechanic, it came from the crew chiefs, it is very hard to crawl up in the foot box on these cars, If Gibbs has any Morals at all these Crew Chiefs will be fired

Dave Rogers is a MI boy. I have hung out with him many times, he is a really down to earth and super nice guy. While I don't root for the Toyota's or KB at all, its nice to see him doing so well. I would hate to think of him pulling something like this and getting fired. He has been doing a lot of interviews lately. And I'm betting he was on his way to getting back to being a cup crew chief. Nascar already took away hp from the Toyota's so I don't really understand why anyone would feel this move was needed.

My guess would be that JGR is upset that NASCAR took the horsepower away. If these tests showed that they were down on horsepower now compared to other brands, maybe they could get it back again???? Just my thoughts.

That does not make too much sense to do because there are other Toyota teams that will still show good hp numbers.

Actually, yes it does. Gibbs is the only Toyota team that does their own engines, everyone else gets theirs from TRD. The experience and talent in the Gibbs engine room is a BIG reason that the Gibbs cars are head-and-shoulders above their fellow Toyota teams.

The big question is...were they doing this in the chassis dyno tests BEFORE they got the new spacer?

Looks like some congrats Bruce...you guys may have been the first CLEAN car across the line a few times this year!

btw...this is what I meant when I said that Toyota would get into trouble in this sport. Check around, they have FAR from a pristine record when it comes to cheating in racing. In fact, they've been flat-out BANNED from a series or two around the globe. NASCAR uses VERY old and basic engine technology. Toyota doesn't like that! They will continue to have a hard time not messing with things. The sad part is, some of what they will want to improve, will make sense, but NASCAR will stick with the old tech for financial reasons.

...gonna be fun!

Actually there are only 3 Toyota teams in Nationwide; JGR, Braun, and Waltrip. JGR is by far the leading team for Toyota so I bet when NASCAR wants to do some testing of Toyotas they would be going there and not to the other two. So if the 18&20 cars that were so dominate that they had to test engines in the first place and make major changes, now show they are at a dissadvantage I would bet that everyone in a Toyota would put up a big stink, and want their original engine package back.

The magnet was just a ploy to draw attention away from the nitrous lines.

Yeah I have a few things like that on my car, it really helps to.................oh wait, oops. nevermind.

OMG Laci hilarious.....

SOOOO when are you going to start USING them Laci??!!!!
Did I print that out loud??!!!

Kidding just kidding....

ouch, lol

I know this is a little off this topic but you mentioned Dave Rogers was a MI boy. I seen that Gary Cogswell was the crew chief for Marcus Ambrose. Gary was from the Lansing area. I worked with him years ago.

How many of you guys read the complete article? A couple asked or commented how long its been going on, it states in the article that the last time the cars were tested on a chassis dyno was in March. The last 2 tests the engine was out of the car. I do agree they were trying to skew the results of the test to affect the outcome and data, but the magnets did nothing to affect the performance in the race.

U have the inside to all the rules and tech, If it is hard to get into the foot box, when would anybody do this after the race. Dont they go to the tech line right after the race, with all the TV tapping how could they do it and nobody see them. Would be pretty funny if they did it before the race and still outran all them cats. Do they tell which teams well be dyno tech before or after the race. U give us a lot of good enfor about NATIONWIDE just like u to comment on this a little more. Richard J Williams

This is where the crew chief got the idea of using a magnet to make his car faster;

AKRON, Ohio - Derby history is on display at the National Inventors Hall of Fame museum, including the 1973 “magnet car,” the first champion car to be disqualified in the Derby’s history.

Officials of the All-American Soap Box Derby have provided a variety of championship cars from over the years, including the car driven by Jimmy Gronen in 1973. After Gronen won the championship, his car was inspected and x-rayed. An electronic magnet was discovered in the car’s nose, which had given the car an extra pull from the starting line plates that were made of steel. For the first time in the Soap Box Derby’s history, the winner was disqualified. On display with the magnet car is a copy of the x-ray that disclosed the illegal electromagnet.

Like their the only ones that have tried cheating they just got caught someones always crying years ago chevy had an advantage before that it was ford shut up and race

IF they fired crewchiefs who did something wrong there would be a lot of guys without job ROUSH HENDRICKS CHILDRESS WALTRIP DEI havent they all had crewchiefs that been suspended one time or the other REMEMBER GORDONS car he ran in the ALL star race they told EVERNHAM dont ever bring a car like that again think it was the JURASSIC car

Thats true but they don't act as holyer than thou christians who can't have a BEER DECAL on their car because of their high morals, I would say if JGR's standards are that high then yes they should Fire the crew chiefs for cheating IMHO

THEY dont allow beer decals i knew PETTY didnt thats why you never seen a PETTY car in the old BUSCH CLASH OR BUD SHOOTOUT DIDNT STEWART RUN THE BUD SHOOTOUT thought you had to have BUDWEISER DECAL on your car

Obviously if they wanted to race the car a less than WOT then they could adjust the throttle stop, But why would they do that????????? they wanted to show LESS HP on the chassis dyno than they raced with, Ive been thinking about how they got the magnets in there and im sure when the interior guy crawls in the car after the race to get all the Nascar GPS hardware out he could reach up around the leg brace and put it in noone would notice cause there is someone crawling around in every car after the race, they do not tell teams that they will be dynoing any cars before the race, but they bring the dyno to every track just in case

What a cool cheat neat deal. Run the race with the magnet next to the gas pedal then slide it under the pedal with your foot on your way to tech. How long do you suppose that has been going on?

It wasn't cheating till they got busted!

JUST went to joegibbs.com look at their wallpapers TONY STEWARTS car has got a BUD decal on it looks like someone got their facts messed up

Click to view attachment LOOKS LIKE A BUD DECAL to me

What I ment to say was a Beer sponsor
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/motor/2007-...461258953_x.htm

OK my mistake i was wondering because STEWART won the BUD SHOOTOUT I thought you had to have a BUD DECAL RICHARD PETTY wont even put any beer decal on his cars

Yes but he didnt seem to have a problem running cars in the Busch series and racing at Richmond through the 90's when it was the Miller Genuine draft 400, my point is if your gonna say no Alcohol then you should be consistant, Petty wasnt and neither is Gibbs

YEA but i suppose RUSTY wrote the book on morals didnt NASCAR approve TOYOTAS engine package but to come on here and question someones morals like you guys never tried to push or bend the rules come on they all do

I never said that, go back and read the posts i didnt question ANYONES MORALS, THEY ARE THE ONES WHOS MORALS ARE WAY ABOVE MINE, I drink Beer, and one thing I can say with the bible in my hand WE DONT CHEAT, Rusty wouldnt stand for it If we did we would be FIRED Period

Bruce, Most of you guys cheat! Don't you remeber last years snow ball derby!!

Thats funny

Oh Yeah I remember that, but that was in no way shape or form anything to do with RWR that was Richie Wauters Late Models team, the one that Kyle Busch gave 2 million dollars to a couple months ago, to get some late models ready for him, how would you like that budget?

I think anyone that races would like that budget!!

I think thats one we can all agree on

I asked our engine tuner from RCR today what happened with Gibbs he said they got away with it on the 20 car but only had the one magnet it was ground to a precise size to only knock the HPs down about 25-30 HP where they got caught was the guy trying to get it in the 18 car, he wasnt very good at being stealthy and got caught, so Nascar had gotten the numbers on the 20 with the magnet on, after they got caught the 20 car was run again without the magnet, Nascar usually announces Penalties on Tuesday, but is waiting until tomarrow on this one, it should be interesting to see the outcome, Oh yah, did you get to see Stevens 3/4 of a lap run Saturday at Michigan? cool huh thats the same car he wadded up at Charlotte on his warmup lap for qualifing, Oh and its getting clipped right now and we have to have it back together for California, after Bristol it needs to leave monday night

FastBruce88, I think you are in the best place to answer this... In your OPINION...will this also show up in their Sprint Cup machines or was this just a Nationwide situation?

Time will tell, you can bet Nascar will be looking for this, Im sure its been done before sucessfuly

I can recall I think it was Kevin Harvick a couple months back that brought up the subject that they were running lots more horse than the other manufacturers and everyone laughed. Looks like he was right.

BRUCE are you guys going to some kind of COT car next year does RUSTY plan on going cup racing in the future and moving STEVEN up that was too bad all the work you guys do and get wrecked after 3/4 of a lap those cars can hit that hard and all you got to do is clip the front

We can't do any Cup Stuff as long as Rusty owns 51 percent of RWR his ESPN Contract will not allow it, The Nationwide team was grandfathered in, The Nationwide series will go to some sort of a COT thing in 2010, quite frankly I wish we would do some Cup stuff, we spend enough to run a Cup Team and are Connected to Penske, We are running Penske colors on our 64 car with Stremme and he will drive the 12 car next year, dont say you heard it from me, Penske wants us to continue running Stremme in the companion races next year, Maybe in a Dodge again with Penske engines who knows, rambling now ......Bruce
PS the car that wrecked needs a front clip and a new body from the windows down, its gonna be a thrash to get it done

YOUR secrets safe GOOD LUCK hopefully you can get one of them in VICTORY LANE before the seasons over BRISTOL would be a good place to start RUSTY always ran good there well alot of places for that matter

Bruce from what I understand you guys are in financial trouble and can not afford a 2 car team.

Now was that really called for?

We are Not in any Financial trouble, In fact we are funded better than some Cup Teams Both Cars are set for the rest of 08 and the 66 is good for 09 the 64 for at least 20 races next year, we have had to do some 1 -5 race deals for the primary but thats why we have 3 maketing people, Rusty is a good saleman and a Better spokesman for any product, and Rusty & Patti own 8 car dealerships plus 20 percent of Iowa speedway, the ESPN Deal pays REAL well, our budget for 2 teams each year is 14 million

JUST REMEMBER EVERYTHING IS A JOKE!!!!!!!!!!! THAT IS PRETTY FUNNY.

I just got a copy of the Dyno Pulls after Michigan, Nascar Dynoed the 30,92,32,40,2,60,5,88,16,1,20,18 Even with the new plate on the Toyotas they still came out on top, Gibbs cars made about 15 more HP than The TRD motor in Brauns 32 Hendrick wasnt far behind, I would copy it and post it here for you but It says Not to Distribute on the bottom and I dont want to get in trouble, These were without the Magnet